Short answer: You don't. A stocked shotgun is effectively smaller in use, if you're trying to sight down the barrel, because you don't have to hold it out in front of you to avoid hurting yourself with it when you fire it. Otherwise, there's trying to fire from the hip, which is action movie material.

The Pistol Grip Only Shotgun - The Perfect Home Defense Tool?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYjThckYqBQ

I hold mine with one hand on the grip and the other on the pump. I fire from the hip so I look like a total badass, sights are for suckers.

I've shot quite a bit of PGO.

Honestly people seem to flip out over recoil being dangerous for the shooter, I don't really know why. As long as you work your way up, it shouldn't hurt even if you put a hundred shells down. The only thing I found was pretty nasty was 2 ounces of turkey 3" magnum shells, webm related. Out of this shotgun, they have the recoil energy and velocity of a 458 Win Mag. It doesn't hurt the wrists, it just stings at the palm skin.

Regular magnum slugs and buckshot really don't do a whole lot. Using an 18" shotgun with PGO, you can hold the foregrip and aim like a normal shotgun, as long as you know what's coming, it's impossible to get hurt. I've shot hundreds of shells in an afternoon, high brass stuff. Not being toughguy, if you hold it right it just doesn't do much.

Do I suggest this for "serious" use, like self defense? Fuck no. It's slower, harder to aim right, etc. However those Forgotten Weapon boys may be absolutely wonderful for information about obscure guns, but they really are doing it wrong when it comes to shotgun recoil. I have no fucking clue how they think it's even uncomfortable when shooting reduced recoil ammo.

>>102944
Here's what 1 ounce winchester magnum slugs looks like, one handed, really not much to it.

>>102943
I also don't really like "bird's head" grips like that. I like grips more like >>102941. Might be personal preference, but when shooting anything more than birdshot with "bird's head" grips, the gun will often slip up and smash the trigger guard against your trigger finger. I'd much rather have the control of the regular pistol grip than have to reacquire the grip.

Here's a buddy of mine shooting 3" buckshot, he'd never fired a PGO gun before that day. A few minutes with some birdshot shells, some pointers on the grip, and he fired boxes of 3" without discomfort.

Here's 2oz 3" magnum out of a 590 with a stock (but held like a PGO), if you think a longer barrel might make a difference. To be honest the extra weight does soak up all the bite that the recoil has.

He wanted to get a pistol and a shotgun today. We didn't get either. His background check was delayed. We'll find out Wednesday. That said, I'm glad this thread is informative.

Italian Benelli Armi Urbino synthetic & wood stock shotguns.

Italian Fabarm 12 gauge (3-inch) pump shorty.

Rounding out the stockless Italian shotguns is this Franchi SPAS 12 12 gauge combat shotgun with the folding metal stock replaced with a simple pistol grip.

Italian Franchi SPAS-12 short barreled shotgun with the arm hook removed.

An expensive and obscure shotgun made popular in a movie.

Russian KS-23M 4 gauge (23x75R) riot gun with no stock.
http://www.operatorchan.org/k/res/90125.html#90150

One with a wire stock.

Russian RMb-93 forward pump-action 7-shot 12ga shotgun.

Soviet TP82 Cosmonaut Triple Barrel Survival Gun.
Because cosonauts were bugged by wolves when they landed in the wilderness of the south Asian Soviet 'Stans.

A legal sawed-off shotgun with an 18-inch barrel and 26 inches overall length.
Legal in that particular state at the time of the photograph, void where prohibited by law, some mileage may vary.

What is the penalty for getting caught with a shotgun with a sawed-off barrel?
Federally, the base penalty for any violation of the National Firearms Act is 10 years/$10,000 fine. You can also receive an enhanced fine for tax evasion for willful violations in addition to the base penalty.
States also have their own penalties for illegal possession of a short barreled shotgun. Montana, as an example, has fines that go from $200 to $1000 and from 5 days to 5 years in jail depending on the severity of the offense and the person committing it. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-appendix/download
https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-penalty-for-getting-caught-with-a-shotgun-with-a-sawed-off-barrel

Turkish/Italian Chiappa Triple Threat shotgun with three 18.5-inch barrels.

>>102960
>404 Not Found
Looks like the board pooped itself.

I can delete that post so you can reupload the image in this thread if you like.

>>102967
Weird, I see it and can load the image just fine.

>>102967
Please delete the old threads with dead thumbnails (from old internet attacks).
- Another shot of the Turkish Chiappa Triple Threat shotgun with three 18.5-inch barrels and a removable buttstock.

>>102961
The Chiappa Triple Threat is heavy (8.2 pounds) and expensive (MSRP of $2,079.00), but is interesting.
https://www.chiappafirearms.com/p.php?id=372

>>102965
>No cover for the trigger(s)
That's how you turn a fun project into leg reconstruction.

Chiappa also makes a copy of the US Winchester Model 1887 12 gauge lever-action shotgun that they call the 1887 Mare's Leg.
5+1 capacity, 18.5" barrel, 7.8 lbs, $1,032.40.
https://www.gunsnammostore.com/p-148134-chia-930019-1887-12ga-185-mares-leg.aspx

  Some review videos complain of the Chiappa 1887 having problems breaking open, like how many reviews of the Chinese Norinco 1887 lever action shotgun having ejection problems. Maybe they needed to be broken in after a few hundred shots? But it's shocking where these modern clones are compared to a ca.1900 Winchester 1887 that works flawlessly with many types of modern loads.
The Chiappa 1887 T-Series Shotgun https://youtu.be/mo7QsrLF7zU
Norinco 1887 Lever Action Shotgun in 12 Gauge https://youtu.be/UisjxqqfIbo
Hickock45 did not seem to have loading problems with this Chiappa 1887 'Bootleg' and he shows how to load 7 shots into that little thing - Winchester 1887 Leveraction Bootleg Shotgun https://youtu.be/ExWX9_lWUPI

>>102972
Indeed! Even the old-timers who made the 1922 Ithaca Auto and Burglar Gun provided holsters that covered the trigger (and the whole grip).

A modern clone of the Ithaca is the Pedersoli Howdah .45 Colt/.410 double barrel pistol.
http://www.ronspomeroutdoors.com/blog/ifg-pedersoli-howdah-double-barrel-pistol-45-colt-410/

  IFG's Howdah Double Barrel .45 Colt/.410 pistol shotgun by Pedersoli https://youtu.be/fig_45lzzNs

Ithaca Auto & Burglar Model B Double Barrel Smoothbore Pistol
Produced between 1925 and 1934, the Auto & Burglar Gun was pitched as just the thing for a homeowner or traveler to keep strapped to their nightstand or steering column to ward off burglars or bandits, while finding an audience with the private security forces of the day as well. Fitted with a single brass bead sight, with a solid rib between the "SMOKELESS POWDER STEEL" and "MADE IN U.S.A." marked barrels, and both sides of the frame decorated with a pointer in a field over the "AUTO & BURGLAR GUN/ITHACA GUN CO. ITHACA, N.Y." markings. Checkered forearm and pistol grip stock, with the latter showing a very sharp angle and pronounced web knuckle for recoil management. http://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/64/3470
Estimated Price: $4,500 - $7,000 - sold for $3450

For nearly 20 years, Mark Serbu’s SUPER-SHORTY has been the standard-bearer among the super-compact shotgun set. Built from either a Mossberg 500 or a Remington 870 that started life with a pistol grip, the S-S is considered an “Any Other Weapon” (AOW) under NFA law, meaning a $5 tax stamp instead of $200 as with other NFA items. I’m really not sure if most people buy these just for screwing around and having fun or if it’s for more practical purposes, but I do know that the S-S is capable of filling both roles. . . http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2015/08/jeremy-s/gun-review-serbu-super-shorty-shotgun/

This sample is built from a Remington 870 and, if you’re familiar with that shotgun (and you probably are), you’ll be right at home with the S-S. Same safety, same trigger, same action lock at the front of the trigger guard, same loading gate, etc. This 6.5″ barrel version holds just 2 shells in the tube — whether 2.75″ or 3″ — while the 13.75″ barrel flavor holds 4.

Specifications: Serbu SUPER-SHORTY

Caliber: 12-Gauge
Capacity: 2+1 to 4+1, based on length
Barrel Length: 6.5″ to 13.75″
Overall Length: As short as 16.5″
Weight: 4.5 to 6 lbs
MSRP: $1,050 to $1,225 depending on gun (Mossy 500 or Rem 870) and options (such as breacher muzzle device)

Or you can just get a cheap and reliable slide-action shotgun with a pistol grip, like a Mossberg 500 or Remington 870.

>>102970
I'm not gonna delete threads willy-nilly like that.

But you're free to post more KS23 ITT.

>>102986
No! Not until you delete that junked thread!

>>102987
We lost a bunch of images in older threads due to a software fuck-up awhile ago, though it looks like most of those have been pushed off the end of the board already. Stoplossed's ancient M1 Garand improvement thread, >>90456, still shows the effect, but that's no reason to delete the whole thing.

I went and deleted that whole thread myself. About half of the images were unviewable.

Anyone tried a shotgun suppressor?
- US Remington 870 MCS AOW shotgun with a Salvo suppressor.

>>102960
You meant to type the feds shoot your dog, kids, and wife.

>>102941
fuckin useless but fun. get bird shot and get good at hip firing its a blast