>>103219
>Have you thought about a FN SLP? I like 'em.

The aim is to get a pump (for fun, not an actual practical reason). Being semi as well is just gravy.

  >>103241
Pump-automatic guns are pretty satisfying, unless it's a Benelli Nova, they're shitty. The two downsides to pump guns are (1) Having to pump it and (2) No recoil reduction. Not ideal for competition, hunting, or slaying bodies, but I don't think that matters to you.

Let me see if I understand the criteria here:

1. Shotgun
2. Fucking awesome
3. High quality
4. US firearms laws need not apply
5. Pump action

The Benelli M3 is probably the best gun and most practical.

The SPAS-12 is legendary in coolness, but is a heavy bitch.

Maybe a Winchester 1897 Trench Gun? I'd skip the Chinese one and try to find an original.

This is probably the next gun on my list to get.

Photo from our old friend, DrakeGmbH.

The Remington 870 is a good gun***. I've got a ~2008 production gun that's good to go.

*** It's heavy and outdated. It was designed in the late 1940s.

The 1960-1980 production "Wingmasters" are nice guns. (I'd do some research on the dates there.) The deep bluing is beautiful.

The "Police" guns are also good to go.

  I know WarPlanRed is going to hate me for this, but I really don't like Mossbergs. I'm not impressed by the 500 or 590. They cycle like there is gravel in the receiver.

I've seen multiple 930 JM Pros turn into "Jam Pros". The regular 930's seem to run ok.

>>103244
Here's my 870, with side saddle and face melting Streamlight TLR-1HP. (Which has now moved to the SCAR 16 for night shoots.)

I shot one sporting clays event (150 rounds) with the 870 and immediately bought a semi-auto gun.

The 870 with the original 26" barrel and the semi I bought, the Beretta AL391. I got the 391 for ~$800, it was a steal. The previous owner put a box of shells through it and decided he didn't like it.

  The Beretta AL391 shooting sporting clays.

> Yeah full choke!

The video is pretty useless since you can't see the clays, but at least you can see the gun cycle.

I've tracked down two NIB Entry models in France, which I can import. But they'll easily cost as much as a Tactical + a Rem870 on top. And I'll likely to spend a bit of extra to buy the classic stock since it comes with the telescopic stock.
On the other hand, if I just get the 20" Tactical, I kinda feel I might regret it long term... Always wondering if the 14" wouldn't be handier/cooler/more unique.

>>103242
>The Benelli M3 is probably the best gun and most practical.

Well, since you mention recoil in your post, the M3 is rather shitty at sucking up recoil in semi mode. Still kicks hard. Harder than pure semi shotties.

>>103243
>Maybe a Winchester 1897 Trench Gun? I'd skip the Chinese one and try to find an original.

An original good condition one costs more than a brand new M3 Tactical though. Maybe as much as an M3 Entry.

While I love sword bayonets and slam firing as much as the next guy, this is a bit much.

>>103245
>I know WarPlanRed is going to hate me for this, but I really don't like Mossbergs. I'm not impressed by the 500 or 590. They cycle like there is gravel in the receiver.

Yeah, I've got a feeling that the 500/590 are just cheap work horses of the "good enough" kind. I'd prefer something more refined.

>>103245
>WarPlanRed is going to hate me for this, but I really don't like Mossbergs. I'm not impressed by the 500 or 590. They cycle like there is gravel in the receiver.
I had to polish mine a bit to be smooth, and the 590A1s with the thick barrels are super heavy. I tend to recommend old 870 Wingmasters, they can be found for $300 and they're by far the best built, smoothest, and nicest pumps for the money.

Might sell the 590 actually, now that I have a Wingmaster with a long barrel and a 12" barrel, I'm not sure I really have any purpose for the Mossberg. That or sell/trade it for a 535 3-in-1 combo, they're cheap, they shoot 3.5" shells, and come with everything you'd need to hunt any game with a shotgun. My 590A1 has been sitting around for a while, it's fun to take out sometimes because of the sights and how beast it feels, the pump stroke still makes me smile. Mossbergs, once polished, have the most distinct mechanical feel to them. It's like no other shotgun, and the sequence of smooth clicks and shlacks you get from pumping a 5** is just Adeptus Mechanicus bonerfuel. For that reason alone, I will probably always own a Mossberg.

>>103249
>Yeah, I've got a feeling that the 500/590 are just cheap work horses of the "good enough" kind. I'd prefer something more refined.
With a bit of work they're good, but my feelings for them have definitely cooled since my experience with 870 Wingmasters. Aside from the aforementioned pump feel.

>>103246
>I shot one sporting clays event (150 rounds) with the 870 and immediately bought a semi-auto gun.
This might be a downside to some, but I see it as an upside; the older Wingmasters are in 2 3/4" only. That does restrict your versatility a bit, but the upside is the pump stroke is shorter than pretty much any other production 12 gauge out there. It's fucking fast when you start getting the hang of cycling a 2 3/4" only action.

Definitely a plus if you're buying a pump that you never have the intention of using for anything that would require longer shells than 2 3/4".

>>103250
> 2 3/4" shells ... 3.5" shells

Everything is a tradeoff.

2 3/4" shells - Standard 12ga length. Can kill anything on the planet with the right load. Fast cycling, lots of ammo availability.

3" shells - For when you want to fuck with your friends: Slip a 3" turkey load into the tube.

3 1/2" shells - Replacement for 10ga. Mostly used for bird genocide and dislocating shoulders.

We had a dueling tree set up at the last 3 gun. One dude brought out his bird gun. Only 2 in the mag tube, but whatever. Every time he hit the tree, it would shudder and flip the 3 (required) targets around. Damn. Ok those targets are neutralized.

We inspected his ammo: 7 1/2 birdshot (ok) and 3 1/2 inch shells. (ohhhh)

>>103251
Indeed. I wanted to point it out because I haven't often seen people mention that when discussing one pump shotgun over another when the purpose of the gun is specified.

>3 1/2"
I particularly like the 3 1/2" turkey loads. Kent, Federal, and Winchester amongst others make the 2 1/4 ounce at 1150 to 1250ft/s from those shells. These days I've been shooting quite a bit of the Kent Diamond 2 1/4 ounce from my buddy's 870 Supermag.

I tell ya it's a wild ride, but cycling that action is like left-hand jab practice.

Muh mids 70's wingmaster.

Turns out that Benelli DEFENSE does still sell the Entry model (calling it the M3 A1 14" and 14.5" Door-Breacher), but not Benelli civilian? Guess I'll need to contact some police suppliers...

My advice is to go with your gut. If you think there is even the most remote chance you'll regret the 20", laws of pessimistic living state you will. Even if it's harder to procure, the 14" seems to me to be what you really want. So pursue that Great White Buffalo. Overcoming the challenge of acquiring it will only make it that much more special to you.

From experience I say the Mossy 930 can be damn good. Mine was shit out of box, and I mean complete jammomatic junk. The shotguns bolt and carrier need to be sanded smooth, and the recoil spring needs its ends smoothed out. My 930 needed the extractor spring snipped and weakened to function right. Now this gun runs the lightest, cheapest shot with no hiccups. It doesn't have the versatility of a M3, but it's 1/3 of the price.

How hard would it be to get your hands on an older Auto 5?

They're super well made and I got mine for around 350$ after tax and transfer in CA.

I wonder why people keep suggesting semi auto shotguns when I clearly primarily aim to get a pump?

>>103323
Auto shotty Master race?

>>103323
How much autoscatter have you shot?

Because I caught the bug pretty quick. Pumps are definitely cool, but autos are just so damn fun.

Ithaca Stakeout is pretty to look at, but not so pretty to shoot. Slightly better with the buttstock than with the pistol grip but still not pleasant. Would help if I could put a modern stock on it but the older Ithacas like mine have a longer stock tang than the newer ones.

I've also owned both an older 870 Express and a Mossberg 500, I favor the Mossberg more because it's lighter and not so prone to rusting. The 870's weight is better at absorbing recoil though.
Have the hunting model Winchester 1200 with the 28 inch rib-ventilated, full-choke barrel. It strikes a good middle-ground between the 870 and 500 I think, and has slain many squirrels.
Also impulse-bought a Mossberg SA-20 a while back. It's alright for a Turkish gun though it doesn't reliably digest low-brass birdshot. To be expected though.

No pictures right now as I am on my other laptop.

Good news everyone.

After constantly hounding the distributor & various stores, it turns out that the new Benelli M3 A1 14"/14.5" will be available in Belgium somewhere in May. It's practically the same price as the standard M3 Tactical even.

That means I need to get started on my permit application etc. Best case is 2 weeks, worst case is 4 months...

>>103325
>How much autoscatter have you shot?

None that I can remember. Only pumps (rem870), O/U (Beretta & Browning) & SxS (don't remember) so far. And even only few of those.

>>103331
Give it a go if you can, maybe before settling on a purchase.

There's not a whole lot quite like slinging half a pound of lead in two or three seconds just from pulling on one little trigger.

>>103331
>Good news everyone.

Bad news everyone. The store just contacted me to say Benelli changed their mind and that they won't be available in May and could not say if they would import it in the future or not.

Benelli M3 Tactical remains available though, so that question is if I should wait & keep pushing, or just settle for the full length Tactical.

>>103495

>buying m3 tactical
>settling

Gonna need you to pick one.
I know it not exactly what your heart desires, but damn. People would kill to afford a shotgun that nice.

>>103503
Yeah I can just imagine Godvie all like "Damn they didn't have the Merkel model I wanted so I had to settle for the Blaser Luxus".

Hey man, life is too short to settle for cheap shit.

I've grown to accept that I'm an elitist jerk. Aside from just high quality guns, I really appreciate overengineered and mechanically interesting guns.
Which is not to say that some cheap guns can't be great in their own right, obviously. I'm not that far gone...

don't know if you care, but benelli has stopped importing the m3 in all variations to the US, the m3's largest civilian sales market. M3 looks on the way out of production so stock up on parts now.

>>104958
>don't know if you care, but benelli has stopped importing the m3 in all variations to the US, the m3's largest civilian sales market. M3 looks on the way out of production so stock up on parts now.

Considering Benelli Defense Italy just released the M3 A1 this year, I doubt it's going out of production in the EU. They also have too much law enforcement market to just stop providing spare parts.

Winchester has always been my favorite shotgun brand. My dad has several pumps that are older than I am (30+ years) that run really nicely. I've taken a look at the guts of the SXP and it's pretty similar to the old 1300, just made with more modern techniques.

I'd suggest looking around for some old 1300 Speed Pump shotguns. They can be had for chump change.

If you gotta have NIB, which I totally understand, I'd suggest looking at the SXP again.
The issues were due to a production SNAFU in 2015, and limited to 3 1/2" Chambers. FWIW my buddy has an old 870 that was his father's first gun, and I've seen it fall over from resting against a tree, and fire with safety on.

If you're willing to spend Benelli money on a gun, then I'd look at the the FN P12 if you want the tacticool, next.

The P12 is around ~$700, the SXP Defender considerably cheaper at ~$450, in the US.

All that said, you do you. Just trying to help a brother out.

I have a Vepr 12. It's pretty neat.

The point is moot by now, since I've already requested the permit for a Benelli M3. Can't use that permit for anything else.

After months of promises, the Benelli importer for Belgium finally came clean and said my Benelli M3 Tactical won't be produced any time soon because the machines are all working full swing to produce more US Marine Corps M4s. And my permit expires on the 30th of November.

I'm mad.

So I'll need to get off my ass and import my own, pronto.

I've found several M3 Tacticals in Germoney, but if I need to import my own, I'm trying to track down the SBS version. Just because FUCK YOU, that's why.
I've found an SBS version in France, but it's way more expensive (like 500 bucks more expensive) and it's got the ugly collapsible stock like in >>103216 & >>103214 and I'd prefer the classic one like in >>103249. Buying a spare stock is like 100 bucks, but that's adding to an already more expensive shotgun.

Store with the SBS version doesn't do export...

>>105723
>>105719
What a clusterfuck. You'd think those frogs would be accommodating with that price tag...

>>105725

It gets worse.

Through sheer desperation, I also contacted a local gunstore which is mostly focused on high price fudd hunting guns (Browning, Aya, Heym, Piotti, up to H&H and full custom guns). Turns out they just became Benelli importer.

The other guys which we were in contact with lost their import partnership with Benelli & that's why they can't deliver jack shit. So instead of being up front about that, they decided to just lie their fucking ass off?

I really don't know what to believe anymore, because Benelli hasn't updated their partner/dealer page yet.

But this is some seriously fucked up shit.

Pic related should be in the next delivery to the local gun shop. So I'd need to swap the stock & it'd be good to go.

>>105783
>>105738
Shame it isn't an SBS but at least you found one.

>>105784
>Shame it isn't an SBS but at least you found one.

Well, if I'd ever decide to shoot matches, it would have needed to be one with a long mag tube anyway. It's less cute, but overall it's more practical.

Also, if I really still want an SBS one, I can just order the barrel next time I'm requesting some permits and modify the mag tube.

>>105786
Oh that's good, I wasn't sure if you were allowed to get a shorter barrel and stuff. I have a hard enough time keeping up with canuck and US laws, eurobong laws are all bizarro land for me.

>>105787

Well, the permit needed for the barrel is the same as for the shotgun (meaning a significant amount of paperwork & wait times), so it's a bit of a pain, but I could combine it with future requests, so that'd be fine.

I don't mean to hijack your thread Godverdomme, and if you want me to start a new one just let me know, but I'm in a similar boat.

I've been shopping for a shotgun for a while now, and I don't know exactly what to get. My budget is flexible, but I'd like to stay under/around $1,200. I'm looking for something Semi-Auto, and I'd like to stay with inertia driven for the purposes of simplicity. As of right now, I'm looking at 2 main options:

Stoeger Family (M3000, M3K 3-Gun)
Benelli Family (Probably the M2 - but I don't know if I should look at the Montefeltro or Vinci instead).

The Stoeger would give me room to buy a pistol as well, which is a plus as I'm shopping for a new nightstand gun, but it seems like the Benelli is the nicer option with more aftermarket support. Primary use of the gun would be for Skeet/Trap, as well as Home Defense and potentially 3 gun further down the road. Any input would be appreciated.

>>105846
>I'd like to stay with inertia driven for the purposes of simplicity.

It's my understanding that this generates more perceived recoil though.
And it's not like the alternatives are especially complex.

>Primary use of the gun would be for Skeet/Trap, as well as Home Defense and potentially 3 gun further down the road.

My gut tells me that skeet/trap have quite different requirements than 3-gun, but I'm sure that someone with more experience in that can shed more light on it.

>>105847

>My gut tells me that skeet/trap have quite different requirements than 3-gun, but I'm sure that someone with more experience in that can shed more light on it.

Yeah, basically I'm presuming that if I move on to 3-gun I'll get something else for trap and skeet like a Super Vinci or something. I know that the M2 and the M3000 can both become 3 gun shotguns through basic mods, but they can operate as trap/skeet guns immediately. Doe that make sense? It's why I'm not looking at a Vinci now; it can be a trap/skeet gun but it really doesn't have the aftermarket to support it as a 3 gun shotgun.

I also forgot to mention, but having the ability to get a Slug barrel would be nice as well. Here in Ohio most firearm deer hunting seems do be done with shotguns and the option would be good. Though it's a secondary concern, I could probably pick up a used 870 Police Magnum and get a slug barrel for not all that much.

>>105853

Plenty of slugs work fine without rifling though. So depending on what you aim for, a dedicated slug barrel may not be required.

>>103512
you do do you, man. I've slowly arrived here over the years.
Guns are expensive to replace, buy the ones that last.

>>105864
Indeed!
Rifled lead slugs can be fired through regular smoothbore shotgun barrels, even ones with chokes, although improved cylinder works best. The rifling on these lead slugs imparts very little spin, but it allows these slugs to be swedged through any size normal choke. A rifled shotgun barrel allows you to shoot the more accurate sabot or copper-jacketed slugs.

Years ago, I bought a $200 Remington 850 pump and added a $90 Mossberg rifled shotgun barrel. Really unnecessary as I use cheap Brenneke slugs, but the barrel came with a length of rails that extends over the top of the lock that can fit sights to it. I put a cheap reflex sight on it and it works great at the 100 yard range that slugs are effective in. Other hunters love red dot scopes on their slug barrels.