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Patches and Stickers for sale here

File 15591001724.jpg - (159.27KB , 1021x681 , 357-Mag-6.jpg )
108811 No. 108811 ID: b6e91c
Soon I will have my first revolver, a .357 magnum, and I want to know about weird rounds.
For years I've seen weird ass .357 rounds around the internet and I never really asked about them or looked into them because for years I never owned any guns and until recently I was never interested in revolvers. So now I don't know what any of them are called or how to find them.
Can you tell me about them, anon?
Expand all images
>> No. 108812 ID: c3b8cf
Most commercial .357 magnum ammo you will find will be hollow points, but FMJ exists. Most .357 magnum JHP should do just fine for defensive purposes. You may occasionally find semi-wad or full wad-cutters, which some prefer for defense, but I like them because they punch clean holes in paper. I prefer 125 grain projectiles for felt recoil purposes. Some people like unjacketed lead projectiles, although this is more common for cowboy action shooting I think.

However, the other great advantage of .357 magnum is the ability to shoot .38 special, which is a lot cheaper and has much lighter recoil, albeit a much weaker round for defensive purposes compared to .357 magnum. I prefer 115 to 130 grain rounds as a good balance of shootability and cost.

It's easy to save your brass with revolvers. I don't reload myself, but I have a very reputable reloader (Bullseye Cartridge in NW Houston) that I go to and he charges me roughly 13 cents a round to reload my .38 special casings with 130 grain FMJ.
>> No. 108815 ID: 51b0a9

Ah. Pull the pills from Czech 9X19SMG AP loads. Stuff them on a fat stack of Unique.

Instant .38 AP loads.

Mind the cylinder gap.

{An aside, there is little difference between the projos used in .38 Special, .38 Auto and 9X19, and they are all but interchangeable. I have shot thousands of pre WW1 black powder .38 S&W loads from my horribly abused S&W Victory. The pills just sweged down and shot fine.

I also fire .32-20 from my 1892 Ordinance revolver. In this case the projo has gobs of room, but it still nicely sizes the case. And is reasonably accurate for range use.
>> No. 108816 ID: 04d80a
File 155918579664.jpg - (307.70KB , 1249x1280 , bullets, _38 Special and _357 Magnum cartridges.jpg )
The .357 Magnum is a popular round and there are all kinds of unusual bullets for it.
>> No. 108817 ID: b774b1
>Stuff them on a fat stack of Unique.
Curious, how much are we talking here?
>> No. 108819 ID: b6e91c
File 155924234063.jpg - (58.79KB , 1000x1000 , amm-1001-030-10_1_a.jpg )
Here's a weird one.
>> No. 108820 ID: b6e91c
What the fuck is the second from the left there? It seemingly does not even have a bullet in it.
>> No. 108821 ID: 1daec1
File 155924762084.jpg - (444.72KB , 1781x1781 , bullets, wadcutter _38 Special w 148 grain hollow-.jpg )
That is probably a flush wadcutter bullet.

Pic: .38 special wadcutters with the bullet loaded flush with the case mouth. On the right is an unloaded 148 grain hollow-base wadcutter bullet to show its relative size to the case. The target under shows the typical clean round holes cut by wadcutters.

A wadcutter is a special-purpose flat-fronted bullet specifically designed for shooting paper targets, usually at close range and at subsonic velocities typically under approximately 900 ft/s (274 m/s). Wadcutters have also found favor for use in self-defense guns, such as .38 caliber snubnosed revolvers, where, due to short barrel lengths, maximum bullet velocities are usually low, typically under 900 ft/s (274 m/s), and improved lethality is desired. Wadcutters are often used in handgun and airgun competitions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wadcutter
>> No. 108822 ID: 48e02c
File 155924853778.jpg - (151.60KB , 1177x1114 , bullets, _357 Magnum Metal Piercing - Geco PM 1.jpg )
The .357 Magnum Metal Piercing round is interesting. Here's some Geco PM.
>> No. 108823 ID: 04d80a
File 155924985585.jpg - (218.52KB , 1600x1063 , bullets, THV - Très Haute Vitesse - very high spe.jpg )
And then there's the THV or Très Haute Vitesse (meaning very high speed). Originally conceived in France in an attempt to produce an ammo particularly intended for police use. The intent was to achieve good penetration, stopping power and accuracy lowered recoil and to lessen the "danger to surroundings outside the target".
>> No. 108824 ID: 04d80a
File 155925398961.jpg - (75.63KB , 1000x1334 , bullets, THV hollow high speed for French police 9.jpg )
The story starts in France, with an attempt to produce pistol ammunition particularly intended for police requirements. The stated aim was to achieve good penetration, stopping power and accuracy while achieving a marked drop in recoil and in the "danger to surroundings outside the target"; i.e., a short range. The designer was a Mr Antoine; he was hired by SFM (Société Française de Munitions) who promptly secured the patents, produced the ammunition and began to market it.

The design principle was to produce a very light bullet which could be launched at high velocity (hence the name THV = Très Haute Vitesse = very high speed). The bullets had a sharp point which in conjunction with the high velocity was intended to provide excellent barrier penetration. However, the sudden widening of the bullet behind the point was designed to generate a wide wound channel, and the light weight meant that it would quickly lose velocity, both in the target and (should it miss) in the open air. It was therefore only suitable for short-range use, and SFM only produced pistol rounds. As well as the three pistol loadings in my collection it was also made in .38 Special and .45 ACP. The cartridge cases are headstamped 'THV SFM' with the calibre.

The bullet material is not specified in the manufacturer's data sheet but appears to be copper. The bullet was made with a hollow base, reducing the weight still further. The bullets were made with two different shapes: the first type had a simple point, but this was found not to feed well in self-loading pistols. A second pattern was therefore developed, with a wider, blunt tip, for the auto pistol loadings.
>> No. 108825 ID: f5c3ed
They make for good, light target loads.
>> No. 108826 ID: b6e91c
File 155950650878.jpg - (154.10KB , 1125x971 , e0ecba37-93b9-4125-bd20-2e52c05120c3.jpg )
What are these weird bullets? They're ribbed
>> No. 108827 ID: e56201
Just some kind of heavy copper turned projectile. The ribs are to reduce bearing surface, thereby reducing friction and chamber pressure.
>> No. 108828 ID: e56201
Took me a whopping 2 minutes to find.
>> No. 108829 ID: 48ddd0
File 155954276382.png - (1.31MB , 1300x826 , bullets, solid cast (left), with gas check (center.png )
The ribbing is to keep the bullets (especially solid copper, brass or bronze cast bullets) from wearing out the barrels. The channels between the ribs can be filled with lubricant. Sometimes a little brass cup, called a gas check, can be fitted to the bottom to seal the gasses, fit the rifling and further prevent barrel wear, like the copper driving bands around artillery shells did.

A gas check is a gasket type component of firearms ammunition. Gas checks are used when non-jacketed bullets are used in high pressure cartridges. The use of a gas check inhibits the buildup of lead in the barrel and improves accuracy.
Gas checks are most commonly found in the form of a thin cup or disc made of a ductile metal. Copper, zinc, aluminum, and alloys such as brass have been used. A bullet designed to accept a gas check has a rebated base shank which permits attachment of the check without altering the maximum diameter of the bullet. The shallow cup-shaped check is mechanically attached to the reduced shank of the bullet by swaging. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_check

- Cast bullets as cast (left), with gas check (center) and lubricated (right).
>> No. 108830 ID: 218cb4
File 155954309053.jpg - (59.67KB , 1200x803 , bullets, solid bullets recovered from big game 1.jpg )
I remember hearing of big game hunters, back in the 1980s, talking about using solid copper, brass or bronze bullets that could smash through thick skin and bones of really big game like cape buffalo, rhinos and elephants. The solid bullets were even recovered and loaded again for more big game use when deep penetration was desired.
>> No. 108831 ID: ee9094
File 155954318432.jpg - (220.96KB , 1200x797 , bullets, solid for big thick-skinned rhino 1.jpg )
This rhino was taken down with a solid hunting bullet.
>> No. 108832 ID: d6e893
File 155954358852.jpg - (79.66KB , 1200x797 , bullets, solid Breakaway solid _416 Rigby 1.jpg )
Some modern solids have polymer caps, probably to prevent ricocheting like how soft metal ballistic caps were used on armor-piercing artillery shells that smushed against angled tank armor that prevented the hard penetrator from glancing off.
>> No. 108833 ID: 218cb4
File 155954375772.jpg - (453.36KB , 1536x2048 , bullets, solid from Swift Bullets _375 penetrates .jpg )
These solid bullets from Swift Bullets in .375 reportedly penetrates 80 inches of wet newspaper.
They say these are solid, but there is an obvious core made from a different kind of metal.
>> No. 108834 ID: d6e893
File 155954410470.jpg - (144.86KB , 1000x789 , bullets, solid 9mm Solid Copper Bullet 106 gr 1.jpg )
More recently, copper bullets were researched by militaries and ammo-makers to have lead-free bullets that do no contaminate the area.

- 9mm Solid Copper Bullet 106 grain.
>> No. 108835 ID: 7bc924
File 155954419711.jpg - (99.32KB , 1154x1154 , bullets, solid PMC Bronze _223 Remington FMJ-BT 55.jpg )
Solid PMC Bronze for .223 Remington FMJ-BT, 55 Grain.
>> No. 108836 ID: 7bc924
File 155954428091.jpg - (106.23KB , 1154x1154 , bullets, solid PMC, Bronze Line, _50 BMG, FMJ-BT, .jpg )
Solid PMC, Bronze Line, .50 BMG, FMJ-BT, 660 Grain.
Stuff is stupid-expensive, though.
>> No. 108837 ID: d6e893
File 155954446765.jpg - (894.72KB , 1280x882 , bullets, solid brass Match Multi Band _50 BMG 802 .jpg )
Solid brass Match Multi Band .50 BMG 802 grain bullets.
Solids tend to be long bullets to give them the weight of lead bullets.
>> No. 108838 ID: d6e893
File 155954452130.jpg - (696.10KB , 1280x871 , bullets, solid _416 Barrett 415 grain solid brass .jpg )
.416 Barrett 415 grain solid brass.
>> No. 108839 ID: ee9094
File 155954466818.jpg - (150.80KB , 1023x769 , bullets, _408 CheyTac 419 grain solid bronze.jpg )
.408 CheyTac 419 grain solid bronze bullets.
>> No. 108840 ID: 7bc924
File 155954472974.jpg - (155.73KB , 1200x803 , bullets, _577 Tyrannosaur 750gr Woodleigh soft, _3.jpg )
.577 Tyrannosaur 750gr Woodleigh soft, .308, 750gr Barnes Banded Solid.
>> No. 108841 ID: 218cb4
File 155954485326.jpg - (11.38KB , 600x450 , bullets, 2 bore & 3500 gr (_5 lb 1_326-in 33_6.jpg )
A 2 bore cartridge and a 3500 grain (.5 lb 1.326-inch 33.68mm) bronze solid by a .700 nitro express.
>> No. 108842 ID: 218cb4
File 155954493331.jpg - (14.77KB , 550x412 , bullets, 2-bore S&H 3500 grain bronze solids.jpg )
2-bore S&H 3500 grain bronze solids and a dime for size reference.
>> No. 108843 ID: 48ddd0
File 155954509896.jpg - (273.16KB , 1024x768 , bullets, brass Serbian Solid Brass 7_62x39 cutaway.jpg )
You can even find solid bullets for your Kalashnikov, such as with these Serbian Solid Brass 7.62x39mm rounds.
>> No. 108844 ID: 7bc924
File 155954514877.jpg - (272.13KB , 1024x768 , bullets, brass Serbian Solid Brass 7_62x39 cutaway.jpg )
>> No. 108845 ID: d6e893
File 155954532851.jpg - (103.68KB , 846x1159 , bullets, CompBullet solid copper alloy, machined v.jpg )
Here's some CompBullet made from solid copper alloy with machined vents to reduce friction.
>> No. 108846 ID: d6e893
File 155954537564.jpg - (65.44KB , 930x1115 , bullets, CompBullet 9mm 100 grains solid copper al.jpg )
CompBullet 9mm 100 grains solid copper alloy, machined vents.
>> No. 108847 ID: d6e893
File 155954558756.jpg - (20.25KB , 450x236 , bullets, subsonic Russian 12_7x54mm VSSK sniper, s.jpg )
Subsonic Russian 12.7x54mm VSSK sniper, solid bronze, AP.
>> No. 108848 ID: 7bc924
File 155954598986.jpg - (314.34KB , 1024x768 , bullets, shotgun 12 ga_ Remington 3-inch 1 oz Copp.jpg )
Even some shotgun slugs use a solid copper slug in a sabot, such as this Remington 12 gauge 3-inch 1 oz Copper Solid Sabot Slug.

And here is a solid copper sabotted slug shown next to a Brenneke & Foster slug.
>> No. 108849 ID: 7bc924
File 15595460346.jpg - (355.17KB , 1024x768 , bullets, shotgun 12 ga_ Remington 3-inch 1 oz Copp.jpg )
>> No. 108850 ID: ee9094
File 155954637327.jpg - (122.14KB , 616x799 , bullets, solid brass bullets.jpg )
>> No. 108863 ID: 751d6a
I don't see how those vents will help at all. Or do anything for that matter.
>> No. 108864 ID: ee9094
File 155987264626.jpg - (69.65KB , 1041x1419 , bullets, CompBullet _30 - 125 grains.jpg )
Seeing as that design went nowhere, the CompBullet was probably a failure of what it tried to accomplish.
>> No. 108865 ID: f5c3ed
File 155988612045.jpg - (18.41KB , 600x375 , ammunition-polycase-inceptor-357-mag-arx-ammunitio.jpg )
ARX ammo .357 Magnum. 86 Grain IDK "drill bit"?!

I know a guy who carries a 9mm Charter Arms revolver with the same "ARX" bullet. He's an RSO at my go to indoor range...
>> No. 108914 ID: b6e91c
Oh! I CC a Ruger LCPII with these. Gel block tests show these penetrate really well. I never knew there were .357 magnum ones.
>> No. 108916 ID: 51b0a9
"Enough". Half the fun is figuring out the works.
>> No. 108918 ID: f5c3ed
Nah man not me. I don't intentionally fuck around with handloading.
>> No. 108947 ID: 6fe1bd
Reminds me of that time my buddy was handloading 9x19 for his Sten. Brass was coming out belted, primers flying out of the brass in mid-air, headstamps flattened out shiny.

He then says "I think they're hot enough"
>> No. 108966 ID: 51b0a9
That's a fucking STEN. They do that with Mk2Z.
I'm convinced that STENs were made to fuck up 9X19 brass.
>> No. 108986 ID: bbee29
File 156108209064.jpg - (110.52KB , 1058x705 , 136643110740.jpg )
I know, that's why I didn't ask him to stop.
>> No. 109259 ID: b6e91c
File 157332122145.png - (157.00KB , 854x404 , Screenshot_2019-11-09 38 Special Ammo.png )
I found these weird things at Cabelas.
>> No. 109260 ID: b6e91c
File 157332131768.png - (206.18KB , 404x221 , Screenshot_2019-11-09 Buy Personal Defense HST Mic.png )
I mean, look at them, they'd act like a parachute in the air. How the hell do they even fly straight?
>> No. 109262 ID: fec7a2
File 157334333928.jpg - (52.33KB , 960x860 , jet engine miniature 1.jpg )
I dunno.
Maybe from the miniature jet engines in the hollow bullets?
>> No. 109263 ID: fec7a2
File 157334370570.jpg - (233.91KB , 1200x768 , bullets, Federal HST _38 Special 1.jpg )
Federal HST .38 Special +P Review and Ballistic Gelatin Test
This new HST design is fairly unique and, as far as I know, it’s the first time a major ammo company has marketed and sold a .38 Special jacketed hollow point with an almost completely cylindrical profile
>> No. 109264 ID: fec7a2
File 157334382683.jpg - (200.65KB , 1200x572 , bullets, Federal HST _38 Special 2.jpg )
Federal is marketing this new load as a Micro HST, which means it will supposedly perform well even out of a short barrel. To pull this off, they’re using a 130 grain jacketed hollow point bullet with a unique new design. It’s basically a hollowed out cylinder that’s seated almost flush with the case mouth. Years ago, there was a fad where handloaders would stick wadcutter bullets backwards in the case hoping that would make them expand on impact. It didn’t really work, but this new HST kind of resembles that same concept only with a modern jacketed bullet.
>> No. 109265 ID: fec7a2
File 157334472931.jpg - (190.65KB , 1200x470 , bullets, Federal HST _38 Special fired from the S&.jpg )
Recovered bullets from the S&W 342PD gel test.

The barrel is only an eighth of an inch shorter than the 2-inch Kimber test gun, but every revolver is like a unique snowflake and you can’t always assume it will shoot within a specific velocity range based on barrel length alone. This turned out to be a perfect example. The Smith averaged 782 feet per second. That’s pretty slow — it’s 42 feet per second less than the Kimber, which I thought might be enough of a change to potentially have a measurable impact on terminal ballistics.

I actually happened to have one spare block of gelatin at the range and some pieces of our heavy clothing fabric barrier, so I did a quick gel test. The first shot looked really nice. Same kind of expansion as before with a respectable penetration depth of 12.8 inches. But (and here’s why we always do a five shot test), the next bullets did not penetrate quite as well. One of them hardly expanded and only made it to 10.4 inches.

So it looks like this bullet needs a minimum velocity around 800 feet per second in order to give it the best chance of meeting the FBI standard. Even though some of these were under the 12-inch ideal minimum, by .38 Special standards, this is actually not terrible performance overall. I probably would not carry it in this particular gun just because it’s so light and I’d rather have a standard pressure low recoil load that will let me get back on target quicker. With a slightly heavier gun, I would strongly consider using the HST, especially if the velocity clocked in at 800 or better.
>> No. 109269 ID: 0d01d8
File 157388014664.jpg - (54.06KB , 1023x642 , hydrascorpion.jpg )
They are designed to deform when they hit something solid. Flying through the air, they are the same shape they are in the cartridge case.

They fly straight because the rifling makes them spin and gives the bullet gyroscopic stability.

Expanding bullets with wadcutter-ish geometry aren't a new concept (see attached image, for early "National Ammunition"/"Liberty Ammunition" .38 Special Hydra-Shoks, circa 1977), but this is so far as I know the first time one of the big ammo makers has done it.

I personally don't understand why they believe it's necessary now, other than weirdness-for-its-own-sake ("It looks so different. That must mean it's really good, right bro?"). The HST, with its precut, prestressed soft lead wire core doesn't need unusual bullet shapes to expand reliably, as we see in the auto pistol caliber versions.

And when I ponder the possibility of fumbling with a revolver and a speedloader in a dark alley, while some crackhead amped up on bath salts and puffer fish toxin tries to kill me, those fat blunt cylindrical cartridges do not give me warm fuzzies. Give me a bullet design that's going to line up with those chambers and drop into place a little easier. Shrink the meplat 1/16" and bevel it at the point, or something. Throw me a bone here. Jesus.
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